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Pastor Joel Hunter Named to Orlando Sentinel's "25 Most Powerful" List of Leaders

" ... 15. Joel Hunter, senior pastor of Northland, A Church Distributed. (Last year: Not ranked.) Hunter, 64, is the first religious leader to ever make this list. He's widely respected locally. And nationally, he's known for having prayed with presidents Obama and Bush. Hunter's thoughtful and serious approach to faith continues to attract thousands every week to his Longwood-based congregation."

READ MORE: http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/politics/os-scott-maxwell-most-powerful-people-20130101,0,4516284.column

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In Obama's First Term, an Evolving Christian Faith and a More Evangelical Style

Screen Shot 2012-10-29 at 10.27.32 AM VIEW FULL ARTICLE AND PICTURES AT: http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2012/10/27/in-obamas-first-term-an-evolving-christian-faith-and-a-more-evangelical-style/

Washington (CNN) - President Obama's prayers for a strong first debate may not have been answered, but that doesn't mean the prayers weren't happening.

Before he stepped onto a Colorado stage earlier this month to face off with Mitt Romney for the first time, Obama joined a conference call with a small circle of Christian ministers.

"The focus of that prayer was, 'Oh, Lord, you know precisely what the president needs to say,'" says Kirbyjon Caldwell, a Methodist megachurch pastor from Texas who helped lead the call. "'You know what this country needs during the next four years.'"

"'And so I would pray that your primary will and words that you want the president to say will fall from his lips,'" Caldwell goes on, recalling his prayer.

Obama, for his part, was mostly silent.

"There's a profound and genuine humility in the presence of Christ himself," Caldwell says, describing the president on such calls. "I think he recognizes it as a holy moment."

It was the second time Caldwell and Obama had prayed by phone in as many months. The two had connected in August on a prayer call Obama has hosted on his birthday every year since coming to the White House.

Welcome to the intense, out-of-the-box and widely misunderstood religious life of President Barack Obama.

Though he famously left his controversial pastor, the Rev. Jeremiah Wright, the year he was elected to the presidency, a handful of spiritual advisers close to Obama say that his time in office has significantly deepened his faith.

Stephen Mansfield, a former Christian pastor who wrote the book "The Faith of Barack Obama," goes so far to say that Obama has experienced a spiritual transformation.

"I think we do have at heart a new man, so to speak," says Mansfield, who worked closely with the White House and with some Obama religious advisers on his book. "He has undergone a pretty significant personal religious change in his first term."

Obama's faith advisers say Mansfield goes a step too far, though they acknowledge that when it comes to his faith, Obama has changed.

"There is a deepening development in his relationship with God," says Joel Hunter, a Florida-based pastor who has been in touch with Obama nearly every week since he took office. "He chooses to stay faithful in daily habits of study and prayer and consistent times of interchange with spiritual leaders."

"I am not sure he did that before he came to the presidency."

Whether or not Obama has been spiritually "reborn" in the evangelical sense, his spiritual counselors say the president's faith has helped shape his first term in ways that haven't been appreciated by voters or the news media.

And they say the presidency is bringing Obama to a new place in his faith - building on a system of belief and practice that helped bring him to the White House in the first place.

Talking like Billy Graham

These days, when the president talks about his faith, he sounds like a born-again Christian.

Addressing the National Prayer Breakfast in Washington this year, Obama recalled meeting the nation's most iconic evangelical Christian, Billy Graham, and described his struggle to find the right words as he prayed aloud with the aging evangelist.

"Like that verse in Romans, the Holy Spirit interceded when I didn't know quite what to say," Obama told the gathering, invoking the New Testament.

It was hardly the only part of the speech where Obama was speaking "Christianese" - employing a lexicon familiar to evangelical Christians, who put a premium on quoting Scripture and communing directly with the Holy Spirit.

At the same breakfast, Obama spoke of spending time every morning in "Scripture and devotion" and dropped the names of "friends like Joel Hunter or T.D. Jakes," both well-known pastors of evangelical megachurches.

"He was talking like Billy Graham" at the breakfast, says Mansfield, who also wrote an admiring spiritual biography of former President George W. Bush.

"While I'm proud of what we've achieved together, I'm far more mindful of my own failings," Obama said in his acceptance speech, "knowing exactly what Lincoln meant when he said, 'I have been driven to my knees many times by the overwhelming conviction that I had no place else to go.'"

Such pious talk marks a departure from how the president discussed his faith life before his White House years.

Back then, Obama cited his religion more as a basis for social action than for spiritual sustenance. He would temper declarations of belief with affirmations of doubt.

Asked in a 2004 interview whether he prayed often, Obama, then a candidate for U.S. Senate in Illinois, responded: "Uh, yeah, I guess I do."

In a 2007 interview with the Chicago Sun-Times, Obama voiced skepticism about Scripture.

"There are aspects of the Christian tradition that I'm comfortable with and aspects that I'm not," he said. "There are passages of the Bible that make perfect sense to me and others that I go 'Ya know, I'm not sure about that.'"

These days, Obama forgoes such equivocations in favor of a full-throated Christianity.

To Mansfield, the evolution of Obama's comments on religion bespeak a born-again experience, prompted largely by the president's break with Wright and his arrival into a circle of spiritual counselors that includes many evangelicals.

The White House declined requests to speak to Obama.

But Hunter, the president's closest spiritual counselor, says Obama has technically been a born-again Christian for more than 25 years, since accepting Jesus at Wright's Chicago church in the 1980s.

But it's in the last four years that the president has become more evangelical in his habits.

He now begins each morning reading Christian devotionals on his Blackberry.

And then there's the circle of pastors Obama has begun praying with before big events like the first presidential debate.

A circle of evangelicals

After landing in Washington following his 2008 election, Obama shopped around for a new church. But he wound up making his spiritual home instead among a circle of far-flung pastors that includes Hunter, Jakes and Caldwell, the minister from Texas.

Conference calls with the group started while Obama was still a presidential candidate, including on the night of his 2008 victory. The president-elect spoke by phone with Hunter and other Christian ministers, rejoicing in victory but also grieving the death of his grandmother, who helped raise him, just a few days earlier.

The migration from Wright - who almost brought down Obama's campaign with videos that showed him sermonizing about "God damn America" and "the U.S. of KKK A" - to this new group, says Mansfield, has been underappreciated.

"[Obama] went into the Oval Office ... questioning the only pastor he'd ever had," Mansfield says. "Wright left him humiliated."

"And there were deeper questions about the theology that [Obama] had received," Mansfield continues. "Some part of Wright's religious orientation had failed."

Where Wright is a liberal mainline Protestant, emphasizing liberation and social action, Obama's new circle of pastors includes theologically conservative evangelicals like Hunter and Jakes, who stress God's grace and personal transformation.

Mansfield notes that the chaplain who has presided for the last few years at Camp David, where Obama spends many Sundays, is also an evangelical.

Some of Obama's spiritual counselors credit Joshua DuBois, executive director of the White House Office of Faith-based and Neighborhood Partnerships, with leading Obama to a more evangelical-flavored Christianity. Caldwell calls him the president's personal pastor.

A former associate pastor at a Pentecostal church in Boston, DuBois is the one responsible for sending Obama Scriptures and scriptural meditations five days a week; Hunter does it on the other two days.

DuBois convenes a daily 8:15 a.m. conference call with pastors to pray for the country and the president, who is not on the call. (Lately, those calls have also included prayers for Mitt Romney.)

And it's DuBois who organized the president's circle of spiritual advisers. After graduate school at Princeton, DuBois talked his way onto Obama's staff at the U.S. Senate, repeatedly driving to Washington to make his case after job applications were rejected.

When Obama launched his presidential campaign a few years later, DuBois was plucked as its faith outreach director.

The 30-year-old White House aide plays down his influence on his boss.

"He has always been on a Christian journey," DuBois says of Obama, "and the challenges of the office, of being leader of the free world, provides a deepening and strengthening of faith, and that's what you see with the president."

"I remember working with him around the Scripture he would use at the memorial service for the miners in West Virginia," DuBois says, referring to the 2010 tragedy that left 29 dead. "These are obviously moments when one's faith is strengthened."

The unparalleled trials of the Oval Office have been known to deepen the religiosity of presidents ranging from Abraham Lincoln to Ronald Reagan.

Hunter says the same thing has happened to this president: "His faith has been growing as the challenges of the presidency have become more naturally the main part of his own everyday life."

One of Hunter's first Oval Office encounters with Obama came shortly after the president took office, at a time when the economy was shedding 750,000 jobs a month.

"He acknowledged at that meeting what many may know but few remember: that by the time issues get to the president, there are no simple or clear answers or they would have been solved by others," Hunter says. "So we prayed."

A few months later, Hunter was in the Oval Office again, noticing that "the unremitting heaviness of the office was setting in."

"I saw something that has been consistent ever since: He cannot just pray for himself and his family," Hunter says by e-mail. "At least I have never seen it. His faith, his heart, always includes those who are being left out through no fault of their own."

Despite the changes they've seen in Obama, both Hunter and DuBois are uncomfortable with the word "transformation" when it comes to Obama's White House faith life.

"The president doesn't deal in labels," says DuBois. "He knows God's grace is sufficient for him and beyond that doesn't get into labels, evangelical or mainline. He's a proud Christian."

Loving God by loving your neighbor

When the Rev. Sharon Watkins and a group of fellow Protestant ministers sat down with Obama at the White House a couple years into the president's term, she knew the pastors would get wonky about religion.

"You get a bunch of ministers in the room and we're all church geeks - it's theological," says Watkins, who along with the other pastors had come to talk about poverty. "But the president got every biblical allusion and reference. ... He's just a person who is biblically and theologically literate."

If Obama's personal theology has grown more conservative, he is inclined to apply it toward liberal political ends.

"I'd be remiss if my values were limited to personal moments of prayer or private conversations with pastors or friends," Obama said at the National Prayer Breakfast in February. "So instead, I must try - imperfectly, but I must try - to make sure those values motivate me as one leader of this great nation."

In signing laws that have increased Wall Street regulations and stopped health insurance companies from rejecting patients with preexisting conditions, Obama said at the breakfast, he wanted to "make the economy stronger for everybody."

"But I also do it because I know that far too many neighbors in our country have been hurt and treated unfairly over the last few years," he continued. "And I believe in God's command to 'love thy neighbor as thyself.'"

Obama went on to frame decisions as disparate as ending tax breaks for the wealthy and defending foreign aid as examples of biblical principles in action, quoting Jesus' teaching that "for unto whom much is given, much shall be required" and invoking the "biblical call to care for the least of these."

That last biblical reference also loomed large in another 2011 White House meeting between Obama and a group of religious leaders. They'd come to urge the president to protect programs for the poor amid his fight with Congress over raising the nation's debt ceiling.

The Rev. Jim Wallis, a progressive activist, recalls the meeting:

In pressing Obama to take cuts to those programs off the table, one Roman Catholic bishop told the president that "the text that we are obliged to obey does not say 'as you have done to the middle class you have done to me.'"

"It says as you've done to the least of these, you have done to me," the bishop said. "I know that text," Obama responded. The passage is from the Matthew 25 in the New Testament.

"So there was this very rigorous conversation," Wallis says, "and we pressed him on applying Matthew 25 to this decision about protecting those who were the least of these."

Ultimately, the programs that the religious leaders were lobbying for were protected in the debt ceiling deal, though it's unclear how big a role the religious leaders played.

For liberal Christians, such victories embody the justice of the social gospel, the idea that believers should do God's work - even aid the Second Coming - by improving society.

"I do notice that sometimes, like on health care, when [Obama] says it's the right thing to do, it's him saying you love God by loving your neighbor," says Watkins, who leads a mainline denomination called Christian Church (Disciples of Christ). "He's doing the best he can to be guided by God so he can be a faithful follower of Christ."

Skeptics might write off Obama's Bible talk as sanctimonious window dressing, aimed at no higher purpose than connecting with churchgoers in the purple and red states. But translating the Good Book into progressive politics has always been a mainstay of Obama's political biography.

'An awesome God in the blue states'

When Obama landed on Chicago's South Side in 1985 as an idealistic 23-year-old, eager to start work as a community organizer, he was already a political liberal.

He was also a man without a religion, the son of a spiritual-but-not-religious mother whom he would later describe as "a lonely witness for secular humanism" and an estranged African father who was born a Muslim but died an atheist.

Obama's work in Chicago, built around causes like tenants' rights and job training for laid-off workers, was steeped in religion.

His salary was paid by a coalition of churches. And the job took him into many black churches, among the most influential institutions in the neighborhood he was organizing, including Wright's Trinity United Church of Christ.

After a lifelong struggle to fit in, set in motion by his mixed-race parents, Trinity felt like home.

"I came to realize that without a vessel for beliefs, without an unequivocal commitment to a particular community of faith," he wrote later, "I would be consigned at some level to always remain apart."

The changes that Wright's church wrought weren't just personal. Baptism and active membership there equipped Obama with an ability to connect with churchgoers he was trying to organize - and, years later, with religious voters he was trying to win over - in a deeper way.

Wright, who did not respond to interview requests for this story, gave Obama a moral framework for his liberal politics. The pastor espoused a black liberation theology that equates Jesus' life and death with the plight of those who Wright saw as disenfranchised, from African-Americans to Palestinians.

"Wright is the religious version of almost everything Obama already believed without religion," says Mansfield, who spent time at Trinity for his book. "It's a support of oppressed people anywhere in the world."

When Obama emerged on the national stage, his comfortable religiosity and sensitivity to the concerns of churchgoing Americans helped distinguish him as a Democrat.

"We worship an awesome God in the blue states," he declared to huge applause in his keynote address at the 2004 Democratic National Convention, catching the attention of young Christians like Joshua DuBois.

But at that same convention, Obama's party nominated John Kerry, a candidate who eschewed God talk and who lost his own Catholic demographic on Election Day.

Four years later, Obama hired religious outreach staffers like DuBois for his presidential campaign and made a point of meeting with Christian Right leaders who'd never before heard from a Democratic presidential nominee.

Obama went on to win in places like Indiana and North Carolina, evangelical-heavy states that a Democratic presidential nominee hadn't taken in decades.

If the Rev. Wright had almost brought down his presidential campaign, the controversial minister had also long ago laid the groundwork for Obama to connect with the churchgoing voters who had turned their backs on Kerry.

The politics of confusion

As president, the line between Obama's personal convictions and his political prowess on religious matters can sometimes be hard to discern.

Obama invited the conservative evangelical megapastor Rick Warren to give the invocation at his 2009 inauguration, ruffling liberal feathers. He introduced an annual Easter prayer breakfast as a new White House tradition. He gives shout-outs to young evangelical leaders in major speeches.

All can be seen as genuine reflections of Obama's faith and his appreciation for the role of religious leaders in public life. And in a nation where more people believe in angels than in evolution - a fact that the president himself has publicly noted - all promise political benefits.

The same could be said for Obama's predecessor, George W. Bush, and for presidents as diverse as Jimmy Carter and Reagan: All had deep spiritual streaks that enabled the political art of courting religious Americans, especially evangelicals.

The irony, in Obama's case, is that despite his orthodox utterances - there's "something about the resurrection of our savior, Jesus Christ, that puts everything else in perspective," he said at this year's Easter breakfast - polls continue to show widespread confusion about his faith.

Only half the country can correctly identify Obama as Christian, according to one recent Pew poll, while 17% falsely believe he is a Muslim.

"He's a Christian and he professes his Christian faith - I don't know what else this man has to do to get that into folks' ears," says Caldwell, who was also close to George W. Bush.

But Obama's public piety has helped him bond with young evangelical leaders, who are less tied to the GOP than their parents' generation.

"I was struck by the specificity of what he described in terms of theology and what it means to him," says Gabe Lyons, one such leader, describing a White House Easter breakfast he attended. "His message is very specific and very orthodox."

Where exactly that new orthodoxy comes from - the pressures of the White House, a new circle of religious advisers or, to a certain degree, from political calculation - may become clearer after Obama's presidency, if he opens up about such matters.

Until then, the president is likely to keep speaking "Christianese" - and resisting Christian labels. Dan Gilgoff - CNN Belief Blog Co-Editor

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How Christians Might Think About the President's Faith

The 2012 campaign has placed evangelicals in a paradox. A recent PRRI/RNS poll reveals that white evangelicals support a Mormon presidential candidate over Obama by an overwhelming 49% margin, but are simultaneously the religious group most likely to say it is important for a presidential candidate to share their religious beliefs (67%).
While there are plenty of legitimate policy reasons that evangelicals might support Governor Romney, their willingness to overlook their desire for a coreligionist candidate may also have at least something to do with the fact that 24% of them—higher than any other religious group—believe Obama is a Muslim, and even more are unaware (or unconvinced?) he's a Protestant. What if more evangelicals knew Obama largely shares their religious beliefs?
That the true religious identity of the world's most famous, most powerful man could remain a mystery to so many is itself a mystery. Before and especially during his presidency, Obama has been extraordinarily open on matters of faith, providing ample evidence for his repeated claim to be a devout Christian. The evidence may even suggest Obama is our evangelical-in-chief.
In his excellent religious biography of the President, The Faith of Barack Obama, author Stephen Mansfield spends several pages exploring whether Obama has been "born again." Mansfield's interviews with the President's spiritual advisors suggest so.
"I know he's born again," said Joshua DuBois, head of the White House Office of Faith-based and Neighborhood Partnerships, in an interview with Mansfield. A pastor's kid who served briefly in a Pentecostal pastorate himself, DuBois has queried the President about his faith and found that he "believes what the majority of Christians believe."
Joel Hunter, pastor of Florida's 15,000-member Northland Church and Obama's closest spiritual mentor, is even more emphatic. "There is simply no question about it: Barack Obama is a born again man who has trusted in Jesus Christ with his whole heart."
These assertions of Obama's "born again" status are instructive but only tell us so much. The Christian experience of spiritual rebirth is internal, subjective, and thus difficult to disprove. Moreover, it constitutes only one dimension of what it means to be an evangelical.
Admittedly, the meaning of evangelicalism is contested, and in the United States the term has become loaded with political baggage. Evangelicalism is an exceedingly diverse and diffuse global movement, lacking a unifying political agenda, institutional structure, or doctrinal basis (that's why the e in "evangelical" is usually not capitalized). Yet we can identify core features shared by evangelicals across all continents.
The most widely accepted definition of evangelicalism comes from British historian David Bebbington. According to Bebbington, an evangelical is a Christian marked by four distinct emphases: "conversionism, the belief that lives need to be changed; activism, the expression of the gospel in effort; biblicism, a particular regard for the Bible; and what may be termed crucicentrism, a stress on the sacrifice of Christ on the cross."
If Obama is an evangelical, we should expect to find him in alignment with at least this minimalist "Bebbington Quadrilateral." Let's look at how he squares with each of the four elements.
Conversionism: Barack Obama has a conversion story, if not an entirely traditional one. In his bestseller, The Audacity of Hope, Obama recounts how he warmed to Christianity, and the black church tradition in particular, while attending Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago. One Sunday, Obama writes, "I felt God's spirit beckoning me. I submitted myself to His will, and dedicated myself to discovering His truth." Obama's eventual decision to be baptized "came about as a choice and not an epiphany; the questions I had did not magically disappear."
Only years later would Obama attach salvific significance to his embrace of the gospel. "I believe that faith gives me a path to be cleansed of sin and have eternal life," he told Christianity Today in 2008. His more recent statements sound even more evangelical. At the 2011 National Prayer Breakfast Obama spoke of Jesus, in typical evangelical idiom, as "my Lord and Savior." Still, the President acknowledges that his "faith journey has had its twists and turns"—a testimony that comports with a younger generation of evangelicals who are more likely to conceive of conversion as a process rather than a specific point in time.
Activism: For evangelicals, the experience of conversion naturally spills over into action, both evangelism and social witness. The President has addressed Christian activism on many occasions, and his latest National Prayer Breakfast speech was an extended meditation on how Christian faith compels charity and the pursuit of justice. "The Bible," Obama said, "teaches us to 'be doers of the word and not merely hearers.'We're required to have a living, breathing, active faith in our own lives.And each of us is called on to give something of ourselves for the betterment of others—and to live the truth of our faith not just with words, but with deeds."
Biblicism: Obama begins each day with a brief Scripture reading, and quotes frequently from the Bible. He clearly has a "special regard" for the Bible, though it's unclear if he holds to biblical inerrancy or infallibility. In 2007 Obama told the Chicago Sun-Times, "There are passages of the Bible that make perfect sense to me and others that I go, 'Ya know, I'm not sure about that.'" That was five years ago. More recently, he sounds surer about the Bible. Whereas his first Prayer Breakfast speech in 2009 had just one biblical reference—the Golden Rule, the politically safest biblical citation possible—his 2012 address offered several biblical quotations and allusions, indicating a growing respect for and reliance on the sacred text.
Crucicentrism: Obama has shared his reflections on the cross of Christ at his annual Easter Prayer Breakfast—a new White House tradition he started in 2010. At the 2012 event in April, the President described Holy Week as an opportunity to remember "all that Christ endured," to "give thanks for the all-important gift of grace," and to "celebrate that glorious overcoming, the sacrifice of a risen savior who died so that we might live." That's a summary of Easter all evangelicals can embrace.
We are accustomed to hearing politicians offering guarded generalities about the goodness of faith. It's quite another thing for the President of the United States to personally affirm the atoning death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. If Obama is a secret Muslim, he's really good at making his closet Islamic beliefs sound a lot like crucicentric Christianity.
So, is Obama our evangelical-in-chief? When a reporter asked Obama point blank in 2007 if he was an evangelical, the Illinois senator gave a nuanced, noncommittal answer:
Gosh, I'm not sure if labels are helpful here because the definition of an evangelical is so loose and subject to so many different interpretations. I came to Christianity through the black church tradition where the line between evangelical and non-evangelical is completely blurred. Nobody knows exactly what it means. Does it mean that you feel you've got a personal relationship with Christ the savior? Then that's directly part of the black church experience.
Five years later, his answer would likely be more definitive. As President, Obama has surrounded himself with evangelical spiritual advisors and has regularly interacted with the evangelical community. His public statements and private devotions point to a deepening faith—a path commonly tread by American heads of state. Obama's "experience of the presidency," says DuBois, "is strengthening his Christian muscles, making him a calm, confident, certain believer in Jesus Christ."
Hunter explained to Mansfield that Obama's theologically equivocal statements about sin, heaven, and other topics before entering the White House were those of a man with little biblical training. "He would not hold most of those views now," says Hunter. "He is very much in transition."
Hunter's point is crucial. Critics can piece together dated quotes from the President to paint a picture of a hesitant, heterodox Christian. That is unfair as it fails to account for Obama's progression from the highly unconventional, liberationist Christianity of Jeremiah Wright to the more mainstream evangelicalism of Hunter and DuBois.
But what about the President's policies? Hasn't his "evolution" on gay marriage, for example, gone in the opposite direction of his "transition" on faith matters? Obama may have become more conservative theologically, but he is still liberal politically—placing him somewhere on the Christian Left.
Obama's liberal positions don't sit well with most American evangelicals, and for some his views prove the insincerity of his religious claims. But relating Christian faith to public life is enormously complicated, and every believer must continually examine how he applies changeless truths in a changing world. We are all in "transition" to some degree. Obama deserves grace as he continues to work out what his maturing faith means for his policies.
Evangelicals may evaluate Obama's policy record and find ample grounds to give their vote to Mitt Romney. But in evaluating Obama's personal faith no credence should be given to groundless insinuations and graceless mischaracterizations.
Obama is clearly not a secret Muslim or anything other than what he claims to be: a committed Christian. For evangelicals, the commander-in-chief is a brother in Christ.
Judd Birdsall is a graduate of Wheaton College and a Ph.D. candidate at Cambridge University. From 2007 to 2011 he served at the U.S. State Department's Office of International Religious Freedom and was founding chairman of the Forum on Religion & Global Affairs.

Screen Shot 2012-06-26 at 11.16.01 AM

The 2012 campaign has placed evangelicals in a paradox. A recent PRRI/RNS poll reveals that white evangelicals support a Mormon presidential candidate over Obama by an overwhelming 49% margin, but are simultaneously the religious group most likely to say it is important for a presidential candidate to share their religious beliefs (67%).

While there are plenty of legitimate policy reasons that evangelicals might support Governor Romney, their willingness to overlook their desire for a coreligionist candidate may also have at least something to do with the fact that 24% of them—higher than any other religious group—believe Obama is a Muslim, and even more are unaware (or unconvinced?) he's a Protestant. What if more evangelicals knew Obama largely shares their religious beliefs?

That the true religious identity of the world's most famous, most powerful man could remain a mystery to so many is itself a mystery. Before and especially during his presidency, Obama has been extraordinarily open on matters of faith, providing ample evidence for his repeated claim to be a devout Christian. The evidence may even suggest Obama is our evangelical-in-chief.

In his excellent religious biography of the President, The Faith of Barack Obama, author Stephen Mansfield spends several pages exploring whether Obama has been "born again." Mansfield's interviews with the President's spiritual advisors suggest so.

"I know he's born again," said Joshua DuBois, head of the White House Office of Faith-based and Neighborhood Partnerships, in an interview with Mansfield. A pastor's kid who served briefly in a Pentecostal pastorate himself, DuBois has queried the President about his faith and found that he "believes what the majority of Christians believe."

Joel Hunter, pastor of Florida's 15,000-member Northland Church and Obama's closest spiritual mentor, is even more emphatic. "There is simply no question about it: Barack Obama is a born again man who has trusted in Jesus Christ with his whole heart."

These assertions of Obama's "born again" status are instructive but only tell us so much. The Christian experience of spiritual rebirth is internal, subjective, and thus difficult to disprove. Moreover, it constitutes only one dimension of what it means to be an evangelical.

Admittedly, the meaning of evangelicalism is contested, and in the United States the term has become loaded with political baggage. Evangelicalism is an exceedingly diverse and diffuse global movement, lacking a unifying political agenda, institutional structure, or doctrinal basis (that's why the e in "evangelical" is usually not capitalized). Yet we can identify core features shared by evangelicals across all continents.

The most widely accepted definition of evangelicalism comes from British historian David Bebbington. According to Bebbington, an evangelical is a Christian marked by four distinct emphases: "conversionism, the belief that lives need to be changed; activism, the expression of the gospel in effort; biblicism, a particular regard for the Bible; and what may be termed crucicentrism, a stress on the sacrifice of Christ on the cross."

If Obama is an evangelical, we should expect to find him in alignment with at least this minimalist "Bebbington Quadrilateral." Let's look at how he squares with each of the four elements.

Conversionism: Barack Obama has a conversion story, if not an entirely traditional one. In his bestseller, The Audacity of Hope, Obama recounts how he warmed to Christianity, and the black church tradition in particular, while attending Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago. One Sunday, Obama writes, "I felt God's spirit beckoning me. I submitted myself to His will, and dedicated myself to discovering His truth." Obama's eventual decision to be baptized "came about as a choice and not an epiphany; the questions I had did not magically disappear."

Only years later would Obama attach salvific significance to his embrace of the gospel. "I believe that faith gives me a path to be cleansed of sin and have eternal life," he told Christianity Today in 2008. His more recent statements sound even more evangelical. At the 2011 National Prayer Breakfast Obama spoke of Jesus, in typical evangelical idiom, as "my Lord and Savior." Still, the President acknowledges that his "faith journey has had its twists and turns"—a testimony that comports with a younger generation of evangelicals who are more likely to conceive of conversion as a process rather than a specific point in time.

Activism: For evangelicals, the experience of conversion naturally spills over into action, both evangelism and social witness. The President has addressed Christian activism on many occasions, and his latest National Prayer Breakfast speech was an extended meditation on how Christian faith compels charity and the pursuit of justice. "The Bible," Obama said, "teaches us to 'be doers of the word and not merely hearers.'We're required to have a living, breathing, active faith in our own lives.And each of us is called on to give something of ourselves for the betterment of others—and to live the truth of our faith not just with words, but with deeds."

Biblicism: Obama begins each day with a brief Scripture reading, and quotes frequently from the Bible. He clearly has a "special regard" for the Bible, though it's unclear if he holds to biblical inerrancy or infallibility. In 2007 Obama told the Chicago Sun-Times, "There are passages of the Bible that make perfect sense to me and others that I go, 'Ya know, I'm not sure about that.'" That was five years ago. More recently, he sounds surer about the Bible. Whereas his first Prayer Breakfast speech in 2009 had just one biblical reference—the Golden Rule, the politically safest biblical citation possible—his 2012 address offered several biblical quotations and allusions, indicating a growing respect for and reliance on the sacred text.

Crucicentrism: Obama has shared his reflections on the cross of Christ at his annual Easter Prayer Breakfast—a new White House tradition he started in 2010. At the 2012 event in April, the President described Holy Week as an opportunity to remember "all that Christ endured," to "give thanks for the all-important gift of grace," and to "celebrate that glorious overcoming, the sacrifice of a risen savior who died so that we might live." That's a summary of Easter all evangelicals can embrace.

We are accustomed to hearing politicians offering guarded generalities about the goodness of faith. It's quite another thing for the President of the United States to personally affirm the atoning death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. If Obama is a secret Muslim, he's really good at making his closet Islamic beliefs sound a lot like crucicentric Christianity.

So, is Obama our evangelical-in-chief? When a reporter asked Obama point blank in 2007 if he was an evangelical, the Illinois senator gave a nuanced, noncommittal answer:

Gosh, I'm not sure if labels are helpful here because the definition of an evangelical is so loose and subject to so many different interpretations. I came to Christianity through the black church tradition where the line between evangelical and non-evangelical is completely blurred. Nobody knows exactly what it means. Does it mean that you feel you've got a personal relationship with Christ the savior? Then that's directly part of the black church experience.

Five years later, his answer would likely be more definitive. As President, Obama has surrounded himself with evangelical spiritual advisors and has regularly interacted with the evangelical community. His public statements and private devotions point to a deepening faith—a path commonly tread by American heads of state. Obama's "experience of the presidency," says DuBois, "is strengthening his Christian muscles, making him a calm, confident, certain believer in Jesus Christ."

Hunter explained to Mansfield that Obama's theologically equivocal statements about sin, heaven, and other topics before entering the White House were those of a man with little biblical training. "He would not hold most of those views now," says Hunter. "He is very much in transition."

Hunter's point is crucial. Critics can piece together dated quotes from the President to paint a picture of a hesitant, heterodox Christian. That is unfair as it fails to account for Obama's progression from the highly unconventional, liberationist Christianity of Jeremiah Wright to the more mainstream evangelicalism of Hunter and DuBois.

But what about the President's policies? Hasn't his "evolution" on gay marriage, for example, gone in the opposite direction of his "transition" on faith matters? Obama may have become more conservative theologically, but he is still liberal politically—placing him somewhere on the Christian Left.

Obama's liberal positions don't sit well with most American evangelicals, and for some his views prove the insincerity of his religious claims. But relating Christian faith to public life is enormously complicated, and every believer must continually examine how he applies changeless truths in a changing world. We are all in "transition" to some degree. Obama deserves grace as he continues to work out what his maturing faith means for his policies.

Evangelicals may evaluate Obama's policy record and find ample grounds to give their vote to Mitt Romney. But in evaluating Obama's personal faith no credence should be given to groundless insinuations and graceless mischaracterizations.

Obama is clearly not a secret Muslim or anything other than what he claims to be: a committed Christian. For evangelicals, the commander-in-chief is a brother in Christ.

Judd Birdsall is a graduate of Wheaton College and a Ph.D. candidate at Cambridge University. From 2007 to 2011 he served at the U.S. State Department's Office of International Religious Freedom and was founding chairman of the Forum on Religion & Global Affairs.

FIND THIS ARTICLE AT: http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2012/juneweb-only/barack-obama-evangelical-in-chief.html

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Code of Ethics for Pastors

Screen Shot 2012-06-15 at 9.48.32 AM
Screen Shot 2012-06-15 at 9.48.32 AM

The National Association of Evangelicals has developed and released a "Code of Ethics for Pastors" document and is asking church leaders across denominational lines to sign and uphold its outlined principles in their lives as ministers.

"This is to remind people who they are in ministry and how important their personal integrity, their personal conduct and lifestyle really are for what they are trying to accomplish," Dr. Joel C. Hunter, senior pastor of Northland, A Church Distributed in Longwood, Fla., told The Christian Post.

Hunter, who is a board member of the NAE and one of several pastors who have already signed the code of ethics, said that the document is an important way to reemphasize that those in ministerial leadership need to live above reproach.

"Personal conduct is as important as any theological knowledge – the medium is the message," he said. "With a lot of people coming into the ministry these days without a lot of training or a lot of growing up in the church, many ministers may not be aware or may have forgotten what the expectations are of someone in ministry. It's a great teaching device as well as a reminder."

The document does not describe specific rules or infractions, but does include five primary admonitions. It suggests pastors should pursue integrity, be trustworthy, seek purity, embrace accountability and facilitate fairness. Bible verses are used to support the principles.

Specifically, pastors who sign on to the document vow to, among other things:

Exalt Christ, not self Interpret the Bible accurately and apply it discerningly Be honest and prudent in regard to personal and ministry resources Avoid sinful sexual behavior and inappropriate involvement Build God's Kingdom in cooperation, not competition, with other local ministries "We don't want to be legalistic. We are not into a bunch of rules," Hunter explained. "What we wanted to do is give people a way to commit their life to holiness and excellence looking to Scripture as their standard."

According to a survey of NAE leaders earlier this year, 71 percent of evangelical leaders are not required to sign a formal code of ethics. NAE states that some evangelical leaders noted in the survey that ethical expectations are implicit in doctrinal statements and other organizational commitments that they sign, but the documents include issues outside ethics and don't expound thoroughly on issues of ethics.

The Code of Ethics for Pastors was developed over 18 months through the work of a taskforce that included ethicists, pastors, editors and denominational leaders. The NAE Board of Directors reviewed the document several times throughout the drafting process and unanimously adopted the NAE Code of Ethics for Pastors on March 8.

It was officially released this week after being endorsed and signed by several leading pastors in the Christian community. Pastors that have already signed the document, include Charles Blake, West Angeles Church of God in Christ; Bill Hybels, Willow Creek Community Church; Tim Keller, Redeemer Presbyterian Church; Max Lucado, Oak Hills Church; John Ortberg, Menlo Park Presbyterian Church; Samuel Rodriguez, New Season Christian Worship Center; and Bryant Wright, Johnson Ferry Baptist Church.

Church strategy consultant Ron Edmondson, who is a co-founding pastor at Grace Community Church in Clarksville, Tenn., told CP that he sees nothing wrong with the document, but is not sure of its impact on pastors and churches.

"It's only going to be as good as the character and the heart of the ones who sign it. But it's a step in the right direction and a good positive move for evangelicals to get behind it. We can all agree with everything that is on the list," Edmondson said. "I don't believe just writing it and signing it is going to necessarily improve some of the struggles that we have right now with defining morals."

However, Hunter believes the Code of Ethics for Pastors will certainly have a positive effect and is encouraging other pastors to sign the document.

"When you understand that a public commitment many times is not only a good thing as far as making your congregation feel like you are being your very best for them, but it is also a way of outwardly reminding yourself that you aspire to the best ministry possible in order to represent the Kingdom in the best possible way. I think it has a personal motivational power that is beneficial," Hunter said. "It tends to hold us to a higher standard instead of if we just have this kind of vague idea that 'Hey, I just want to be a good minister.'"

NAE President Leith Anderson stated that most pastors are highly ethical, but few have signed a written code of ethics.

"This is every pastor's opportunity to know, commit and tell others about a personal and professional standard of biblical pastoral ethics. I invite every pastor and every church board to put this code of ethics on the agenda for an upcoming meeting. Discuss. Adopt. Live these standards," Anderson said.

The NAE plans to commission a similar document on ethics for churches. The Code of Ethics for Pastors is available for download and to sign at www.naecodeofethics.com.

Alex Murashko

FIND THIS ARTICLE AT: http://www.christianpost.com/news/pastors-urged-to-sign-newly-released-code-of-ethics-76624/

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Pastor Hunter to Hometown Church: "You’re the Reason I’m In Ministry"

Screen Shot 2012-05-29 at 3.15.23 PM SHELBY -- He is one of the top pastors in the world, and in 2011 was named one of the "50 Most Powerful People in Orlando."

Since graduating from Shelby High School in 1966, the Rev. Joel Hunter also has become one of President Barack Obama's spiritual advisers, but he said little of it would have been possible without the foundation he received from his hometown.

Hunter is senior pastor at Northland Church, in Longwood, Fla., a church where he grew membership from 200 to more than 15,000.

Hunter, who was invited to preach Sunday morning at his home church, The Shelby First United Methodist Church, took the podium around 10 a.m. He started by asking the congregation to excuse him if he happened to cry during the sermon.

Few held back their own tears as he reminisced about his days growing up in Shelby, and shared what the 18 S. Gamble St. church means to him.

"It is so, so good to be back in this church," he said. "Thank you for welcoming me back. This is a big deal to me. A very big deal. I hope you'll all indulge me in a few moments of nostalgia."

"This church is a very big part of who I am. I often talk about the Shelby church in my sermons. I say I went to the First Church in Shelby, Ohio, where all the men wore pin stripes on their suits and all the women wore fruit in their hats."

The whole sanctuary erupted in laughter when Hunter singled out Dwight Somerville, a choir member who has been a church member since 1950.

"I knew Jesus would be here, but I wasn't sure about Mr. Somerville," Hunter said. "This is amazing!"

Hunter said his original goal was never to go into ministry, but that the civil rights movement changed his path in life.

"There was a little custodial couple (who used to attend the church) and they didn't have two nickels to rub together," he said. "There were times in seminary when I just wanted to quit because I didn't think I was good enough to do this -- but that was before I learned it wasn't about our goodness but about God's goodness.

"And from time to time I would get a letter in the mail from that couple with a check for $5. Now I know what you're thinking, back in those days $5 was a lot of money, but it really wasn't -- but it was more than they had. And there would be a little note inside saying, 'Joey, we think you'll be a good minister someday.'"

Hunter paused as his eyes welled up.

"And it was just enough to keep me going," he said, his voice cracking. "That's what this place means to me. You're the reason I'm in ministry. I feel the same way about the whole town."

Hunter's sermon dealt with relationships and the importance of human differences.

"Everyone has a different reason for coming to church," he said. "Some come because of relationships or they're looking for relationships, but they all see that God has something for them.

"If you have someone who thinks just like you, one of you is not necessary. Differences are so important. God knew that in order to be a healthy church, we had to be a combination of differences. So as God grew the church he grew us to work together, and he grew us to be a team."

Jeanette Allard, of Shelby, raved about Hunter's speech as the congregation filed out.

"It was absolutely wonderful," she said. "He's such a good speaker. It was very inspiring. It brought tears to my eyes."

Hunter told the congregation no matter where he's preaching and living, the Shelby church will always be with him.

"Every time I walk into the Oval Office and I speak with the president, you're there. Every time I meet with church leaders from other countries, in meetings so secret no one can ever find out, you're with me. I loved listening to the choir this morning. I haven't heard a church choir in I don't know how long, but I miss it. And I loved listening to all the family concerns you shared. With a church of 15,000, if we did that, we'd be here till next week -- but yet we're in the same church. You have strengths and weaknesses my church doesn't have, but we are all the church together."

FIND THIS ARTICLE AT: http://www.mansfieldnewsjournal.com/article/20120528/NEWS01/205280306/Fond-memories-Shelby?odyssey=mod%7Cnewswell%7Ctext%7C%7Cs

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Obama's Spiritual Adviser Speaks in Shelby, Ohio

SHELBY -- Last week he was sitting comfortably in the Oval Office, but the Rev. Joel Hunter said returning to Shelby this weekend will be an exciting honor, too. Shelby, his hometown, will keep him busy.

Friday night, the spiritual adviser to President Barack Obama spoke at Shelby High School's graduation. Hunter is a 1966 Shelby graduate. At 9:15 a.m. Sunday, he will preach at the First United Methodist Church, where he grew up.

"I went there every Sunday with my grandmother," Hunter said. "I've been in ministry over 40 years, but always think of myself as a kid from Shelby who has a really good foundation."

When he attended Ohio University in the 1960s, Hunter said he never imagined he'd end up in ministry.

"But I was part of the civil rights movement and when Martin Luther King Jr. was assassinated, I felt crisis," Hunter said.

He recalled the words of a former pastor of his Shelby church: "Nothing will be right in the world until you take care of the sin in your own heart."

Hunter began attending the chapel at OU and said he felt a calling from God. He eventually changed his college path, went into ministry and became one of the most prestigious pastors in the country. Hunter is senior pastor at Northland Church, in Longwood, Fla., a church where he grew membership from 200 to more than 15,000.

"I don't really know what to attribute it to," he said. "Every day you go in and try to do the right thing, and God arranges the rest."

Hunter has gained national attention through his relationship with the president.

"About four years ago, I was featured in an article in the New York Times," he said. "Following that article, then-Senator Obama called me and said, 'I want to catch up with you.' He wanted to know what I thought was the right relationship between faith communities and government."

The pair met again at a spiritual event. Afterward, Hunter said, an Obama staff member asked if he would pray for the future president.

"I walked out to a hallway and figured there would be 50 pastors there, but it was just he and I," Hunter said. "Since then, he's asked me to pray for him at major events in his life. The night he was elected president, I was on the phone praying for him."

Since his election, Hunter said, Obama has asked him to write devotions for him every week.

"Our relationship isn't political, it's pastoral. I've simply become a pastoral voice in his life," Hunter said. "I'm very aware of his position and where God has put him in life, but a pastor's life is very simple. Our job is to help anyone who needs to get closer to the Lord. That's my job, no matter who you are.

"Here's the most powerful person in America, but the pastor part of me says, 'Here's just another person who wants to get help.'"

Hunter's Sunday speech is open to the public.

The Rev. Tom Snyder said many local people have fond memories of Hunter.

"This is a great way for the older folks to reconnect and for others to hear from a wonderful man of God," he said.

Hunter will attend the service at 22 S. Gamble St. with his wife, Becky.

"I'm going to talk about lifelong lessons learned from Shelby, Ohio," he said. "I'd like to give people a broader perspective of how God uses us in broader ways than we can think."

FIND THIS ARTICLE AT: http://www.mansfieldnewsjournal.com/article/20120526/NEWS01/205260313/Obama-s-spiritual-adviser-speak-Shelby?odyssey=mod%7Cnewswell%7Ctext%7C%7Cs

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President Obama’s Other Pastor

Joel Urban Faith A conversation with the Rev. Dr. Joel C. Hunter of Florida about his civil rights testimony, defending President Barack Obama's faith, and the local ministerial response to the Trayvon Martin case.

FIND THIS ARTICLE AT: http://www.urbanfaith.com/2012/04/the-pastor-the-president-and-civil-rights.html/

The Rev. Dr. Joel C. Hunter grew up in small town Ohio, the son of a widowed mother who loved black jazz musicians. Now he is a spiritual adviser to President Barack Obama and pastor of 15,000-member Northland, A Church Distributed, in Longwood, Florida. “Cooperation and partnership are hallmarks of Dr. Hunter’s ministry,” his church bio says. “Together, he believes, we can accomplish more because of our differences than we would on our own—without giving up our unique identities.” UrbanFaith talked to Hunter about how this kind of cooperation is possible, and about his unique testimony of coming to faith after the assassination of Martin Luther King Jr., his friendship with the president, and what Sanford area ministers are doing in response to the shooting death of Trayvon Martin. The interview has been edited for length and clarity.

UrbanFaith: You have a unique testimony in that you were involved in the Civil Rights Movement and came to the Lord after the assassination of Martin Luther King, Jr. You also recently wrote an op-ed for Charisma about the Trayvon Martin case. Has racial reconciliation always been a thread in your ministry?

Joel C. Hunter: Yes, it has been. The little town I came from in Ohio didn’t have one ethnicity other than white. I think it was one of those Midwestern towns that had a law about the exclusivity of races. But my mother, who reminds me in some ways of President Obama’s mother, was one of those free spirits who loved everybody and thrived on Jazz: Nat King Cole and all of those great—back in that day they were called “Negro geniuses” with music. And so, when I went to Ohio University, it was a natural thing for me to go to the other end of the spectrum and get involved almost immediately with the Civil Rights Movement. It wasn’t from a faith perspective that that first happened, but when Martin Luther King, Jr. was assassinated, I went to Galbraith Chapel, a little generic chapel at Ohio University, and came to Christ. Caring for those who are left out was at the core of my calling to ministry and that’s always been.

Now that there has been an arrest in the Trayvon Martin case, have things settled down in the Sanford area?

We are in the same county and I’m actively meeting with ministers from Sanford, being led by the African American ministers. We have another meeting scheduled for tomorrow night about how we can take our community toward, not just reconciliation and healing, but toward improvement because of what has happened here. We’ve had ongoing meetings together: prayer meetings and brainstorming meetings. We may have a community memorial service with the Martin family. I’m not sure. The publicity has somewhat died down now, but the ministers and spiritual leaders are much more conversant, active, and cooperative than we’ve ever been. So, I’m thinking God is really going to do something wonderful from this.

As a pastor who comes from a relatively humble upbringing, how do you keep being a spiritual adviser to the president of the United States in perspective?

I don’t know how this happens, but it’s really true: people are people to me. The president is a person. He’s great about this; he has a great sense of humor and he’s very personable, so it’s not like this is a lot of work. I realize that to the world, it’s a long way for a kid from Shelby, Ohio (where the largest buildings literally are the grain elevators for the farmers), but to me he’s a person and the job of a pastor is to help the person in front of him or her to get closer to God. And so, that’s exactly what I do.

I remember a time when I had had a conversation and a prayer with the president and within 24 hours I was back at my church talking to a AIDS-infected prostitute who wanted to get closer to the Lord. It struck me that my conversation with her resembled very closely the conversation I had had with the president less than 24 hours previous. To me, that was the ultimate. That’s what a pastor does. Each person has the same value in God’s eyes. I didn’t count one of those conversations more valuable than the other.

When your five-year-old granddaughter Ava passed away from glioblastoma in 2010, the president called you and prayed with you. How do you respond to criticism of his faith when you’ve been so personally engaged with him on a spiritual level?

The president called me when Ava was first diagnosed and then, of course, he called me when she passed away, so it was very tender and kind thing for him to do. I understand that people are ignorant, that is they lack knowledge about his faith walk. I realize there is some political agenda when people accuse him of not being a Christian. I’m not naïve about that, but the president and the candidate Barack Obama chose—even more after he was president—not to make his faith walk very public because he knew it would be politicized and that’s an area of his life he didn’t want politicized.

I always say that nature hates a vacuum and when you don’t have a lot of information, you will fill it in with your latest email. That’s exactly what happens. I know from personal experience and from many personal conversations that they’re wrong. I know his daily practice of reading Scripture. I write many of those devotions. Our prayer times in the Oval Office, over the phone, and on special occasions have been just as sweet and participatory as you can imagine. Of course, there’s always the defensiveness for a friend. I consider the president a friend and any time a friend is wrongly accused, you want to defend them. But, by the same token, I can’t really go much further, because this is the president and I don’t want to give a lot of information that is not directly related to his role and official duties. So, I have to be very careful about not saying too much.

You were on a press call defending President Obama’s faith around the time the Rev. Franklin Graham publicly questioned it. How do you address other Christian leaders who cast doubt on the president’s faith?

I can and do openly tell them about my personal relationship with the president and my personal knowledge of his spiritual life. Sometimes I say I wish most of the people in my congregation were as attentive to reading the Bible every day, praying every day, and trying to put their faith into practice as the president is. Some of them are really taken aback, because they just don’t have the knowledge. It’s not covered in the media by design. That’s fine. I’m very open about my personal knowledge of his walk.

I heard the president debate Sen. John McCain at Saddleback Church in 2008. He seemed more articulate and comfortable talking about faith than McCain then and continues to sound more comfortable and articulate talking about faith than some other candidates now. Do you attribute doubts about his faith to politics or to his policy positions on issues like abortion?

It’s kind of all of the above. I think a lot of it is politically driven. I also think there’s some racism attached in this. I don’t play the race card, but I do think that because his father was from a different country (not faith, because his father wasn’t a man of faith) and with the hyper-sensitivity about Islam, there’s been an effort to paint this man as being very different because he does come from a unique background.

In that particular debate with McCain, he said something that didn’t quite come out right; he was a little too flip about it. When questioned about when life begins, he said, “That’s above my pay grade,” or something like that. Because he is such a respectful thinker in terms of religious questions, he won’t give the reflexive responses. When he didn’t say the axiom that “Life begins at conception,” he was hearkening back to something that is not particularly addressed in Scripture. If we don’t come from a particular faith tradition that says this is the dogma of my church and you simply look to Scripture, “Does life begin at conception?” is an open question. And so, part of this is because he is very careful not to give just the patently religious responses, or the religious platitudes. When people don’t get those, then they begin to say, “Maybe he’s not a Christian like others that have given us boiler-plate Christianity.” I would say to that: he doesn’t pretend to be a theologian, but he really does want to search the Scriptures authentically and personally, and it’s because he takes it so seriously and so personally that he won’t automatically give the response that everybody is looking for.

Is there a level of theological illiteracy on the part of the general public that contributes to this kind of misunderstanding?

Absolutely. In cultural Christianity in general there is, but specifically, the more fundamentalist versions of Christianity have shibboleths: “You have to say the right thing with the right accent or you’re not really one of us.” Part of the problem is not his level of sophistication, but ours, not his level of thinking, but our lack of more broad-based responsiveness to the depths of the theology of Scripture. When you don’t come with automatic or dogmatic sound-bite answers, that’s a good thing. That’s a sign of personal engagement. But because we would rather just have a category of correct belief and many people are satisfied with that, then we are the ones making ourselves upset. It’s not because he’s not answered adequately; it’s partially our discomfort at not having simple answers. That’s part of the unease with his particular faith walk.

The president comes down on the side of keeping abortion legal and you are pro-life. How do you, or anyone else, preserve relationships with other believers when there are such deep disagreements over these kinds of issue?

Abortion is probably the premiere issue where we see this. I am pro-life; therefore I think that’s a baby. I don’t happen to subscribe to “It’s a baby at conception,” because I don’t see that in Scripture, but I do believe that soon after that baby is implanted in a womb, it becomes a person. So I think abortion is homicide. Having said that, the way that I want to work with other Christians who don’t have the same theological presumption that I do about the personhood of a developing fetus is to keep my eyes on the goal. My goal is to have no abortions some day, ultimately because no woman decides to do that.

Other people say, “How can we reduce, by practical common sense, the number of abortions?” I’m on board. Every baby that can be saved, I think, is invaluable. And so, if I talk to somebody who is pro-choice and they say, “A lot of abortions come from feeling financial pressure or because people are afraid they won’t be able to complete their education, and if we could relieve that kind of pressure, they would carry their baby to term,” I’m all over that. I don’t have to have an all or nothing. That’s why the president and I, even though we would disagree probably on who should be able to get an abortion, we still can agree on the reduction of abortion as a very important goal together. That’s kind of how I walk that through.

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